LISTEN TO THE COIQ PODCAST:

  • Telemedicine is here to stay. What to expect the day after w/ Joe Kvedar

Innovating on the front lines: Finding inspiration and direction during a pandemic w/ Dr. Sandeep Jain

 


Being a pulmonologist and critical care physician gives Dr. Sandeep Jain unique insight into how our healthcare system works — and where some of its failings may be lurking. 

 

After nearly 25 years working in a healthcare setting, Dr. Jain recognized a need for a better, less distracting way to facilitate quality communication between teams of doctors. That’s when he developed his ListenMD app. And it was the pandemic crisis that alerted him to additional patient needs that could be met by making adjustments and additions to his innovative solution.

 

In this episode, Dr. Jain explains the process of development he’s gone through to bring ListenMD to fruition, how the pandemic inspired him to pivot and make adjustments to his solution, and the future of healthcare in a post-COVID culture.  

 

Here are the show highlights:

  • How the pandemic has forever changed medicine (17:41) 
  • A surprising way the pandemic has improved healthcare (5:51) 
  • The easy way to manage 40+ patients and their doctors without endless distractions (9:40) 
  • How to capitalize on all the silver linings from the pandemic (16:49) 
  • Why inferior products trump superior products and how to reverse that (13:31) 
  • The sneaky way insurance companies sabotage the doctor-patient relationship with telemedicine (21:32) 
  • Why telemedicine isn’t as effective as it could be and how to improve it (20:50)
  • How to “tweak” your product to make it more effective for the pandemic (10:33) 
  • Biggest challenges facing doctors and health innovators after the pandemic (32:52) 
     


 

I've spoken with dozens of health innovators, and nearly everyone is trying to figure out their best pivot strategy. But they don't know what to change, how to pivot, or if their new pivot strategy is the right move.

 

So I went into overdrive putting together a clear, actionable 5-step worksheet that will help you quickly define your most viable and profitable pivot path through the COVID crisis. And I’m giving it to you for FREE — no strings attached at https://www.legacy-dna.com/pivot

 

Guest Bio

Dr. Sandeep Jain is the CEO and Founder of ListenMD, a HIPAA compliant messaging app that intelligently delays a message per sender’s request, enabling efficient, less intrusive communication among doctors.

 

He’s also a Pulmonologist and Critical Care doctor, which puts him on the front lines of the COVID-19 pandemic. Dr. Jain has practiced in the Fort Lauderdale, Florida area since 1996 and splits his time between working in Intensive Care units and in Pulmonary and Sleep Medicine.

 

If you would like to reach out to Dr. Jain to learn more about his app or to get involved, you can do so by visiting Listenmd.com or downloading the application ListenMD Doctor, which is physician facing, or ListenMD, which is patient facing. Both applications are free of charge during the current pandemic crisis.

 

Episode Transcript

Welcome to COIQ where you learn how health innovators maximize their success. I'm your host, Dr. Roxie, founder of Legacy-DNA and international bestselling author of ‘How Health Innovators Maximize Market Success.’ Through candid conversations with health innovators, early adopters and influencers. You'll learn how to bring your innovation from idea to startups to market domination. And now let's jump into the latest episode of COIQ. [00:36.1]

Roxie:     Welcome back to the show COIQ listeners, on today's episode I am having a very, very special interview with someone who's on the front lines during this COVID crisis. This is going to be Dr. Sandeep Jain; he is the CEO and founder of ListenMD. Sandeep, welcome to the show.

Sandeep: Yes, thank you.

Roxie: And thank you so much for taking time out of your incredibly busy schedule to speak with us today.

Sandeep: Yes, thanks for inviting me.

Roxie: Yeah. So before we get into, you know, the original part of our conversation where we're talking about, you know, the innovation, the innovation process and what that's gonna, what that's look like, right? So that's what we were supposed to talk about. But I would definitely be remiss if I didn't talk, give you an opportunity to share with us, you know, a little bit about your background, what you do and then what is going on right now in your world. [01:34.9]

Sandeep: Sure. Uh, I'm a pulmonologist and critical care doctor. I've been in practice in Fort Lauderdale, since 1996. So, I do intensive care, half the time, every other week and the other part I do my pulmonary office, sleep medicine and pulmonary medicine hospital. And right now it's a busy time with this epidemic going on so. 

Roxie: And you're in Broward County, Florida?

Sandeep: Yes.

Roxie: I want to say that they have the most cases in, in the state or pretty darn close.

Sandeep: Yes, we are all prepped and ready for the search, and supposedly, things that are going to get worse for the next two weeks and then level off.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So, hopefully we won't be like New York. So of course. [02:32.4]

Roxie: I hope not.

Sandeep: I don't think so at all, no I don’t.

Roxie: No no no I don’t think so. So you mentioned something about the cruise ships earlier. What's going on with that? 

Sandeep: Well, it's sort of sad that all these cruise ships left, you know, even say in March, mid-March, they are leaving on cruises and after all of that had happened, so, of course, it's very sad, you know, to see that the passengers all got infected, the cruise members, the cruise ship, the crew members got infected. So we have some of the crew members and people, in our units right now. So, it seemed avoidable, so, 

Roxie: Yeah, yeah. You know, I'm an avid traveler, a huge fan of cruising and I still can't imagine getting on a cruise ship four weeks ago. Yeah, it's just they, you know, I think a lot of them probably thought that they were getting away from it. [03:37.1]

Sandeep: Yeah and usually cruising a lot of people find it easier because if you have a health condition, you can't travel and move your legs from place to place, the cruising becomes your habit.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: And then you have to do that every year. So people who are not the, I guess people didn't understand the gravity of it. 

Roxie: Right, yeah. Nope. I mean, I think every day we just, you know, it's becomes more and more alarming and scary and the reality of the situation, I think for a lot of us, it's just, even now, you know, being four or six weeks into it, it's still, it's still really quite surreal. 

Sandeep: Yes, every day you have to pinch yourself, what is going on? It's unreal.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So, especially in medicine, when we see these patients who are not responding to anything they normally do, and it's a disease that no one has seen anything like this before, so 

Roxie: That's gotta be pretty difficult for you going in every day. [04:36.9]

Sandeep: Not really. I mean, we just do our job and go there and dress up and, you know, you do something that you think exposed you that day you feel like, Oh my God, let's wait 14 days. And then you say, okay, that passed and wasn’t that bad. So you are always worrying about it. But, but you take the best protection you can and move forward. And, the staff, the nurses and the people who are really on the front lines, the respiratory therapists, they're all very much doing their stuff. Nobody is running away from what they have to do. So it's very impressive. 

Roxie: Well, thank you. I know that you're a really humble man and you know, but, I think just on behalf of all of our listeners, thank you and for, you know, everybody in, in your crew and your team and the work that you guys are doing because it's, it's no easy task, to risk your lives every day for, for, for the benefit of other people. [05:34.6]

Sandeep: Yeah, no, it's, in, in, a way exciting times because, we are as the world facing something together, and people are dying in large numbers, people are not knowing how to treat it. So the collaboration and the information that we doctors are sharing with each other is incredible. I'm getting a test from say a doctor in Spain who's saying, Oh, WHO said this is that, but we are doing this and this is helping. Some Detroit doctors is saying Oh we have a new theory on this, we are doing this and that, you know, and giving this thing and that's working. And then, it's amazing to see that institutions that are all good, like Mayo clinic or Harvard or all the top leads, they're all doing different things. So who do I believe, what do I do? So we have to choose from what you can do or want to do from among the best people and of course when you get overwhelmed with the surgeon, you can just barely keep your head above water, you know. Like in New York, basically they got so overwhelmed, you know; they did the best they can but I think if we are able to not have that bad search, we can try to give the best care, incorporating all the newest thoughts and information, which are shared in real time basically via texts even, you know, So ofcourse the articles in the official channels are coming, but, uh, it's quite amazing what's going on. [07:10.3]

Roxie: So give us a little bit more detail about that and I think that that might be a really nice segue into the solution that you develop ListenMD [07:22.1]

Sandeep: Yes, I always felt for the last three years that doctors are not able to communicate effectively through the medical record system, which is designed to basically get you paid. So you write out a lot of stuff and it gets you paid, how much of it was necessary to communicate to the doctor. So if I am giving you information in my note as a doctor, I am hiding the one needle of information in a lot of hay.

Roxie: Hmm.

Sandeep: Basically that's the hay I get paid with. I make hay by hiding the information and hay, and when you open my note, you are basically blinded by the full page note and what is he trying to say. Well what about writing a simple text message from me to you about exactly what's going on? And, you don't have to find the needle in the haystack. I'm sending you the needle directly. [08:18.0]

Roxie: Wow.

Sandeep: So.

Roxie: So good.

Sandeep: And the other thing I realized is people get distracted a lot. So if I'm trying to send a message to another doctor, and if there are 10 doctors on a case, it’s a collaborative thing. A patient normally nowadays has many doctors, and then first of all when a doctor sees a patient, he doesn't even know who the other doctors are for that patient most of the time. And if you know who the other doctors are, you still don't want to bother them because we are sensitive about our time, we are distracted, we are getting bothered all the time, how can I bother the other doctor and just text him or messaging my necessarily.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: Besides, if I called his office it wouldn't pick up and there would be such a difficulty getting through. So I sort off, made a patented system of messaging, which is to avoid distraction. It's like a distraction free messaging where you basically are able to choose to send the message to the other person at the time that they have requested. [09:20.7]

So if that doctor wakes up at seven and I can see that, okay, he will get it at seven in the morning, or if it's Wednesday, 12 o'clock is a silly time to send the non-urgent message, I can choose to send it at that time. But then if that doctor is able to come to this patient sooner, he can pull it say out of the future, so that’s what the patent envelopes. So, so that's been working out, it's reduced the distraction among doctors as we message each other in a more, in a faster way and for COVID especially, it's very useful because as our needs change, in the old way we could manage 10, 12, 15 patients a day. But if I have to manage 40 patients a day and keep in track with the other four doctors, taking care of that patient, how do I do it? I need my app to do it, to message people without distraction and for them to message me back to share the essential kernels of information. So it's coming in very useful currently. [10:19.5]

Roxie: So where were you or where are you in the innovation process?

Sandeep: I keep innovating, I mean, you know, I can't stop, but that’s one of the dilemma you have as an innovator that right now in fact I'm moving forward with building something Corona specific. So, okay. I realized, only two weeks ago that I have a problem. Patients are inside the hospital room and nobody wants to go into the room and, because you know of course one doctor goes, second doctor goes, you know, people need to do video, cleaning and then the family members are not even in the hospital. They are outside the hospital; they can't come in the hospital.

Roxie: Right.

Sandeep Normally if a patient's 80 year old and gasping and saying, Doctor don't put me on a ventilator, I'm afraid I'm able to talk to the son and the mother in the same room at the same time and manage this whole process of what to do next. [11:18.9]

Here, it’s a vacuum, so I made the feature in my app where I could instantly do video. So if I have a patient card, I can put down this is a next of kin skin and this is what I certified hospital records say this is the next of kin and this is a patient cell number. So then I can have both the patient and the family member on a split screen and then I can discuss with them what's happening, show the family members how their loved one is doing on the ventilator or off it or how they are breathing and get some guidance on and an official HIPAA compliant encrypted way and then also make a little bit of a record and say that this is what we discussed, this is how the patient was doing and this is what we decided and then that faxes over to the nearby fax machine or becomes a note. [12:08.8]

So there was a need for it. So I just said, okay, let me build this feature too, so, so I get to use that. And now the next feature that I am building for that I was talking to the development team today is about building something to manage these patients because we are having these large number of patients who we are managing their inflammatory markers, their respiratory rate, their oxygen saturation. So a unique way displaying the information, a unique way of managing that information so that I can visualize it and take better care on that patient to know when is it time to go to ICU and is it time to involve other people. So all of this I know I can do better through the app. So if I find it useful, I hope other people do so.

Roxie: Hmm…hmm, so are you using some of this, with patients and their caregivers now? [12:58.0]

Sandeep: Yes, I have been, but the, it's a very hard thing to get update doctors or any other person don't, easily change their habits. So even though you might have the best product to get it into active usage requires buying from the institution that you're working with, from the doctors. So yes, we are using with, some doctors, but not all the doctors on board yet. [13:24.2]

Roxie: Hmm. Yeah, yeah. So one of the things, you know, is as you just described, you know, a lot of health innovators have the perception that if I build a solution that is better than what is currently available in the market, that that is going to automatically equal success. And research shows that that is not the case. Having a better solution doesn't necessarily mean market success. You could have far, inferior solutions be more successful than something that is much superior and that is frustrating, right? That's really frustrating. 

Sandeep: I’m still finding that out. I totally know that that it’s a new like that. My solution is so much better and superior, but how do I get the word out.

Roxie: Yes.

Sandeep: How do I market? I’m working in ICU one week and on the floor the other week. I can't hire a marketing team or a sales team, so I keep perfecting what I have in a sort of unreasonable way. I mean, in terms of the expensive involved, I know that I'm, going way beyond than what I should be doing, but I can’t help myself, I just get excited and build further. [14:36.2]

Roxie: Yeah, yeah, yep. And, you know, and that's a common, challenge that health innovators, experience as well is that, you know, especially for someone like you who is a physician that is in the, in the center of the problem, day in and day out on a regular basis. So you're seeing all of these additional problems that could be solved and that you could solve and you could improve it for yourself and for your colleagues and who wouldn't want to add all those features and functionality.

Sandeep: Yes.

Roxie: To make it more robust and helpful. Meanwhile, you know, those, those additional developments require time, right and require money. 

Sandeep: Yes.

Roxie: And, and so it could be, it can be very financially troubling to pour all of that money in a product that we don't have enough resources to actually bring it to market to make it commercially viable.[15:36.3]

Sandeep: Definitely, I totally get it. I don't know if I will make money off this thing, but, I don't know, it's hard to stop though. I mean, you know, you keep doing and hoping that it will take off, but yeah, there are a lot of barriers to that. 

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: To market it, is difficult.

Roxie: Yeah. [15:57.6]

 

Hey, it's Dr. Roxie here with a quick break from the conversation. Are you trying to figure out what moves you need to make to survive and thrive in the new COVID economy? I want every health innovator to find their most viable and profitable pivot strategy, which is why I created the COVID-proof your business pivot kit. The pivot kit is a step by step framework that helps you find your best pivot strategy. It walks you through six categories you need to examine for a 360 degree view of your business. I call them the six critical pivot lenses. As you make your way through this comprehensive kit, you'll be armed with the tools, tips, and strategies you need to make sure you can pivot with speed, without missing out on critical details and opportunities. Learn more at Legacy-DNA.com/kit [16:45.6]

Roxie: One of the things that's happening, the silver linings, one of the positive things that's coming out of this global pandemic that we're all facing One is the solidarity, the global solidarity that you described earlier. The other thing is that, you know, with us having to work remote, work virtual, doors being close to physician offices, and you know, caregivers being separated from the hospital, all of these different circumstances and changes in market conditions are creating a very ripe environment for greater adoption of these digital tools. When, you know, so, you know, if you had folks who were like, I'm really just comfortable with the way that I've always been doing it and now the way I've always been doing it is not available anymore. So I'm being, so now I'm kind of being forced to change. [17:41.1]

Sandeep: Not only that, medicine will never be the same. I myself realized I have been doing on the office, say okay, I was going to do office and see 10, 15 patients, so maybe might have seven patients they put up a video call system. So I use my app so I, that office team, put my off, I go to my office, like, uh, I went yesterday or day before, so, so they had their 10 patients listed out and they were timed up as to what time we have to call. I wasn't that strict with the time cause where the other patients would go if I call them now or later right? But anyway I called all of them through the video, I gave them the test link and they joined me on the video and I did the video call and discussed this, that, okay, you can’t go out, you can't exercise, this, that. Take your seatback machine, take your inhaler. Yes I’ll call in the replacement and guess what? [18:29.7]

Roxie: Hmm.

Sandeep: That is all I do on many of the regular patients. So then when this COVID blows off I mean when this is over, I think the patients will say, Hey, let's do it like we did before. Uh, and uh, and uh, I would say yeah, that wasn't too bad. I mean I don't know how it would play out financially. You know, some doctors are thinking that Oh no…this will decimate our business model, but maybe not. I think there's so much wastage in the system.

Roxie: Yeah, yeah.

Sandeep: With the current digital tools we will now be able to, this is going to jumpstart the telemedicine and make medicine more efficient and better. Because a lot of times people never needed to come into see me, they could have shown that look doctor my CPAP machine is leaking can you order for me a new mask. Okay. I could have done that on the video anyways [19:20.1]

So, yeah, so I think the insurance companies had to catch up with the fact and make a reasonable determination as to how to, pay doctors for the responsibility of care. Because you know, if you just get 5- 12 dollars to see a patient, then doctor will say no no come I’ll tell you your results in person, you know, and but if you are able to empower that doctor and say that, no, you take over his chair and take good care and it doesn't matter if you see him physically or on video. Maybe he could see him every week on video, that's far better than thing once a month physically. 

Roxie: Right. 

Sandeep: A five minute call every week call do far more good.

Roxie: Yeah, yeah. I mean, I think you're spot on and I've been talking a lot about that, to different folks. Just in the last two weeks, you know, the, the Medicare changes in the reimbursement for Telehealth, Telemedicine is, is opening the doors for physicians like you and your colleagues to be able to utilize these tools that's been available for a long time, but you know, the, the financial incentives weren't aligned, right [20:34.1]

Sandeep: No, but with. There is one caveat though. You know, what's happening is that the big companies are able to hire doctors and then patients are forced to see a doctor out of state or somewhere who they don't know. So this importance of having the, I am a proponent of Telemedicine but only telemedicine with doctors that, you know, so I'm comfortable doing Telemedicine with the patients I have a physical, you know, I have one of my office patients who I know and you know, every other visit can be Telemedicine or there could be one physical visit for every four Telemedicine medicine visits. But to have Telemedicine alone, okay, I have a cough let me get something from that doctor somewhere through Telemedicine. But unless you are really following that and knowing that is happening again and again, you will miss out on the fact that that could be a precursor to the cancer. You know,

Roxie: Hmm…hmm. [21:32.3]

Sandeep: So the doctor, patient relationship, has to be maintained through this Telemedicine. So very few apps out there are doing Telemedicine between the doctor who's taking care of the patient and his patients. They are all being Telemedicine. The money lies in doing Telemedicine in a global way that people who are, so I think, like, you know, Teladoc and all of that good companies, but the insurance company has a vested interest in going through that because then they don't have to pay the local doctors. They can just have a big contract with a big company and then they can hire people to do it in a impersonal way. So we have to do it carefully though I don't know where it will go, so [22:21.2]

Roxie: Yeah, yeah. Well, and you know, you make a really good point. So, you know, there's a lot of doors have been flung wide open because we're in a crisis and, and so, you know, things like we can use Zoom, we can use Skype legally instead of this HIPAA compliant environment for a temporary timeframe. Once we get past COVID, we will, we will see those doors that were flung wide open, rightfully so, because we were in a crisis start to close back, not close all the way, but I think that we'll find a happy medium between that reimbursement, that, that safety, that efficacy and putting those protocols in place [22:59.9]

Sandeep: And yeah, and security. I like the app that I've made it all very secure. You know doctors don't want to expose their phone number to every patient and family members. So, you want to show it in a very professional way where your office number shows and then there has to be proof that you talked. So, so some system like what I've made where you can document that you really did make the video call and then you charge for it now it’s better than having, you're saying that I did the video call on Zoom, right?

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So there has to be ways to, go through it. And then the, the other aspect I have to discuss is, medicine has become very much of a electronic game where the electronic health records have made a re patient into a bundle of codes. So if you were a patient, I won't see you as a patient. I will see you as your 20 ICD codes, you know, the calcium around the aorta is a little extra bundle that increases your complexity and gives me a little more money. [24:07.1]

So all I'm interested in is finding out all your blemishes and putting them down and then that gives me a global payment, you see. So then all that medicine becomes very, impersonal where you make a note, which involves all the points that are there, whether important or unimportant, and then show that your message managing it and you get paid. So that's what this medicine has become; that’s become very comprehensive and if some good is there, you have your vaccinations, your preventative care, but on some level it is becoming very, difficult because when I see patients, I'm like the old fashioned doctor, so I look in their eyes. I don't have the EMR in my office. I sort of ask them what the problem is. I spend a long time talking about their one problem and then they feel good about it. Because the doctors are now forced to document so much that there’s…you’ve heard all this, that there is no time. [25:08.1]

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So we have to remove this document to get paid, you know? So somehow somewhere along the line American medicine went off the rails where you started getting paid based on documentation.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: And that has to go away, so.

Roxie: Do you think that that's something that might change during this crisis as well? Is there some type of catalyst, some type of factor that could help move that change that?

Sandeep: Yeah, I suppose because you're finding that, we thought our healthcare was the best, but it is not. Our public health infrastructure is terrible. We were not able to cope with the crisis. We were not able to make enough of the desks available and we are not coordinated. [25:57.1]

Even now, even though I say there’s a lot of energy in the system and every hospital and every person is doing a different thing, but we are texting and messaging and it's not a coordinated thing. So if there was a coordinated place that is talking to the best centers and finding out Hey Seattle you suggest this, Oh you know, New York, these people they suggest this and they disseminate in a very structured way. I can just look at that and follow. But I have to keep my eyes out open to Detroit, New York, to Seattle and then mix and match what I'm trying to do. So we're not set up properly. I think there's a lot to be improved. 

Roxie: So how are you getting in front of your target buyer? How are you making them aware that your solution even exists? [26:48.7]

Sandeep: That's the hard part. I am a, don't have the time.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: And I have not hired somebody from the marketing side. It's so much easier to just keep putting money on development. I just can't buy to hire somebody and pay a lot of money to market that I’ve not done. And in retrospect, I could have done that a year ago or more.

Roxie: Hmm.

Sandeep: So yeah, now I’ll have to do that, but again, developing more is always a next point. So how to get in front of the buyer? I was going to go to the HIMSS meeting that got cancelled.

Roxie: Yeah, we were supposed to meet there last month.

Sandeep: So that got canceled. So that was 35,000 people I was going to expose my you know the app and the concept to. And I think this distraction free messaging the patent that I have is completely valuable because I realize I will not be able to force every doctor in USA to load my app, that's unreasonable. [27:48.2]

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: I think that I should give up on that dream. But the technology that I've made where a doctor doesn't need to get distracted, but for nurses saying, Oh patient was constipated, I gave this something, is that okay? Or, you know, uh, you know, so all those messages coming in real time to the doctor, if they can be slowed down into chunks so that we don't get distracted. if you know the big companies like Cerner or Epic or all the people who do the messaging among doctors, if they license this patent from me, that could be one revenue stream that I can hope for now with the patent.

Roxie: Hmm…hmm. [28:28.5]

Sandeep: And then other thought I have is that I could in fact be a person who is in the middle, the keeping of the preferences. So if, if I have a patent on distraction-free messaging, if there are doctors using company A and company B who don’t talk to each other, but both their companies contact with me to know what times this doctor wants his messages, what time this doctor wants his messages. Then I don't have to be involved in the HIPAA-compliant message itself. They can send to each other, but I can be involved in the timing of the message so that it goes without distraction. So I have to work out a way to be in the middle of the messaging and based on the patent.

Roxie: Hmm…hmm, yep. That makes sense. I can tell that you love the product. You'd love the product development piece. [29:23.0]

Sandeep: Oh, of course I enjoy myself thoroughly. I couldn’t help myself, spending an hour and a half talking about how exactly I will make the inflammatory markers and the Corona specific questions and how that graph look like a virus in a way, you know, so it was like a lot of fun to make that. Yeah and he said, yeah, you could do it in two weeks. No, I said, okay, go for it, you know.

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: Yeah I mean, you know, I have a group of developers who are already hired and doing the job, so I just keep making more things. But this one I thought of believing because if I am able to get more efficient in taking better care of these patients at this time for this particular disease, that would be actually something other people would want to use, you know?

Roxie: Hmm…hmm.

Sandeep: So, and then if they see what all the features I have in terms of distraction free messaging and in terms of collaborative messaging, verify my team of doctors group A like if I'm a ICU team and there's a cardiology team. So if Dr. A1 talks to Dr. B1 on Saturday Dr. A2 doesn't know what Dr. B2 talked about, right? [30:31.7]

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So there's a handoff problem. But if there's a shared messaging that I've made, all that messaging is maintained in the system so that the chance for errors is less. So somehow none of this has happened, you know, none of the messaging systems and all, how what I have made? But, but again, it's how to sell it, how to get it out. 

Roxie: Yes. But you know, I think that research shows that this is a very, a very common experience with, with innovators who, again, have a solution that solves a really a really important need, right. In this, I think, you know, your solution is the way you present it. It's so timely to meet the needs even during this COVID crisis, right in a really powerful and profound way. But if we don't have all the right strategies and all the right tactics to really be able to get to market, then the innovation that really could save lives and improve lives, improve the doctor's lives as they're treating and supporting patients, then it doesn't get into the hands of the people that need them the most. That's why I have this show. [31:48.1]

Sandeep: Beautiful. If this show inspires somebody to partner with me, to get this out there, that will be most useful. That’s why That’s why, I went to the, I signed up for the HIMSS show. So I took this tiny innovation booth and the whole idea was, to get, get the idea out there. There's something called distractions, the messaging. There's something called group, messaging, which works for doctors and and now a, also, I have included the video parts in that, so. 

Roxie: And this is something that is available on.

Sandeep: It’s on app store, yeah. It’s on IPhone store, I think they…

Roxie: Download it right now. 

Sandeep: Yeah, yeah you can, download right now. I keep making new app, all the time. In fact, apple just a, their new version released just today, so I keep upgrading the versions, you know. So I keep improving everything now so. [32:45.7]

Roxie: Yeah. So, so, Mmm. What, what are the biggest challenges that you think that you're going to face as we're coming? It was, we're going through this COVID crisis and we're getting onto the other side of it, as a physician as well as a health innovator.

Sandeep: Well, first we have to get through it. The surgeries have to go away. The, uh, health workers have to come out of it unscathed. I mean, there's a lot of colleagues that have doctors, who are sick on ventilators, you know, so, it is a very risky business. So if everybody comes through, I think medicine will change, we will learn a lot of things. We will learn how to coordinate better. We will learn how to, you know, improve the care, so the hospital administration and the doctors are all working together to handle it. So I think things should, it should give more of a, once you, it's like soldiers when they have fought the battle together, you're bonded, isn't it?

Roxie: Yeah.

Sandeep: So, that's what it is. [34:00.7]

Roxie: Yeah. Yeah, yeah. I agree. I don't, I don't think, I don't exactly how it will be different, but I think that things will be very different. We as people will be very different and I think that, there'll be a lot of good that comes out of it just for humanity sake and that solidarity. 

Sandeep: Yeah. I mean, American medicine has a lot of good things the innovation, the, the discoveries and everybody doing their own thing and finding things that, that, you know, the Chinese system could not have done that because here everyone is doing their own thing and trying on different medicines. And I'm betting that the mortality rate that was so high would be in the next few months will, as soon as possible it will be lower because we are learning new things every day of how to treat. But also there are negative to the American system, which is, there is no, no, you know, the iniquity, the public health, the lack of insurance. So I do think, the health system is due for a big change and this will precipitate the change even in a bigger way, things cannot go on as they have been. [35:11.5]

Roxie: Yeah. Yep. And, um, this healthcare institution, and you know, probably even more so than I do, has been set in its ways for a really, really long time for at least, gosh, for at least 12, 15 years that I've been a part of it. There's been incremental change, but there's been some progress and some great progress that's been made. And at the same time, especially the healthcare innovator ecosystem, we've also been banging our head up against the wall for many years trying to get this alignment of needs and incentives and tools and innovation. And so wouldn't that be the most incredible silver lining is this out of the chaos of this global pandemic is that we really were able to change the healthcare system in a much bigger way than we have in years past. [36:04.2]

Sandeep: I know you're going to tamper the steam by going for the fire, isn't it?

Roxie: Yes, absolutely. So, Sandeep, for our listeners who want to get ahold of you as we wrap up here, how can they get in touch with you if they want to get access to your ListenMD tool, if they want to collaborate with you, if they want to get involved, how do they get a hold of you? 

Sandeep: Well, you know, I have the website, ListenMD, I, I'm still making the updates to the website about the COVID. So I’m still on that, but ListenMD.com, is the name of the website and ListenMD is a company and on the app store, the apps that I have are called ListenMD Doctor that is for our doctors and any doctor can load it and they will have to choose the NPI profile and then they get approved by me and then get expanded into the video, upgraded to the video that's going to be free for everybody, at least in the COVID epidemic. Everybody's free to welcome, welcome to load the ListenMD Doctor app. [37:06.9]

And then the other app is called ListenMD that is for patients. So any patient in the country and that means every person in the show can load the app, they can use it to see all their doctors or who they can search out of the NPI profile and then they can put the appointments with their doctors, they can put whatever notes they want to about talking to their doctor about that and then basically force those doctors to put their heads together. So all the complaint that patients have Oh my doctors never talk to each other. Guess what the patient loads the app puts all his doctors together and makes them talk to each other, from… 

Roxie: Talk about real change. This is a new level.

Sandeep: Yes, you can force that so patients can force that. [37:52.1]

Roxie: Yeah. Well, thank you so much for your time today. I know that you're really busy and so I'm so grateful for the time and the conversation that we've had today. And again, thank you so much for the work that you’re doing.

Sandeep: Thank you Roxie. [38:04.4]

Thank you so much for listening. I know you're busy working to bring your life changing innovation to market, and I value your time and your attention. To save time and get the latest episodes on your mobile device automatically subscribe to the show on your favorite podcast app like Apple podcasts, Spotify, and Stitcher. Thank you for listening and I appreciate everyone who's been sharing the show with friends and colleagues. See you on the next episode of COIQ [38:33.1]